You are currently browsing comments. If you would like to return to the full story, you can read the full entry here: “Testing: One, Two, Three (A 100 Card Singleton Experience)”.
Looking forward to the RecSur tech Video,hopefully with a companion article for references.Keep it going guys.I am a fan.
If you’re referring to my Rec-Sur video posting on Thursday, don’t you fret. No supplementary materials will be needed, as it is a loooooooong decktech that goes into quite obscenely thorough detail.
If you’re referring to Mr. Kool, you need only click “page 2″ for his list (which is close to mine), and watch the video he posted on Friday,
The problem with that GWB elves list is theirs too much faffing around. Elves biggest single strength is its speed and consistancy.
The real problem is that people try to play elves like they play other beatdownish decks. Its actually an aggro combo deck, doesn’t matter if that combo is just throwing out a turn 3 geddon, forestwalking in past blockers on turn 5 or generating unbeatable amounts of life or tokens.
Against 90% of creature decks you will have long game superiority (unless their all running mass sweepers nowadays) the synergies of elves overall are stronger than the individually powerful options other decks run (and that your diluting the deck with).
Less cuteness, less bending over backwards to include “more powerful” cards (because obviously that’s objective and dependent on deck/game state etc), more tribal synergies, speed and face beating please.
I like a couple of the black additions (mind twist and confidant mainly) but I am still not convinced that the added “power” is worth the cost to the rest of the deck.
In summary, Elves shouldn’t (in my opinion) be played as a rock deck, if you try to do so you will find the little guys lacking.
I agree that SOFI is lackluster in my experience with little green men, SOLS is awesome though =)
Heya Kharlis! Which Elves should be included (that I am missing)? I have to be honest: I gave Elves the least amount of love this month!
I see Mind Twist and Dark Confidant in the list above.
nb none of this is set in stone, just ideas as i haven’t played sing 100 for a few months (yay rl commitments).
Cards you probably want
Bathe in Light (the best combat trick you can ask for!)
Essence Warden (pretty much a must kill target for red decks)
Scryb Ranger (evasion is regularly relevent especially suited up, also acts as a fake mana elf whilst helping abusing tap effects)
Constant Mists (sb, sooo good at buying a turn or two against opposing aggro decks allowing you to set up a stupid elvish synergy)
Steely Resolve (sb)
Seal of Primordium (sb, tutorable via enlightened tutor so makes the cut over some of the other options)
Elightened Tutor (maindeck)
Elvish Skysweeper (really good against reanimator, also kills baneslayer and its ilk)
Birchlore Rangers (really complaining about mana issues and cutting one of the fixers seems silly, it also allows stupid starts)
Mark of Asylum
Gempalm Strider (Uncounterable instant overrun..whats not to like).
Glare of Subdual (maindeck)
Survivial of the Fittest (turn whatever small dude you drew into the best dude for the current situation).
Aven Mindcensor (sb)
Retribution of the Meek (sb)
Earthcraft (though the manabase is so basic lite i don’t know if the explosiveness it provides is worth the slot now)
Gigapede (sb vs blue, also with the land returning effects seems pretty strong against midrange strategies)
Ankh of Mishra (sb)
Vines of the Vastwood
Root Maze (sb, depending how many fetches everyone runs now)
Nether Void (faux geddon)
Brairhorn (better than it looks)
Engineered Plague (sb)
cards i think are sketchy.
Luminarch Ascension (lots of white to activate)
Baneslayer Angel (double white? i think i’d rather have elspeth or ajani if i was going for a double white costing card)
Creakwood Liege (slow card advantage isn’t what your after generally)
Seeker of Skybreak
All of these could be fine, though they generally hurt your consistancy (double or more off colours), are costly to cast/use or are superflouous to what the decks trying to do.
Cards i hate (in elves)
Oath of Ghouls (isn’t this jsut a worse oversold cemetary?)
Teneb the Harvester
Vigor (6 mana might as well be a million outside god/crappy flooded draws)
Golgori Rot Farm
Wirewood Herald (your hoping they kill your dude?)
Sensei’s Divining Top
The other consideration is that elves might just not be a good choice now, when i was playing it most other decks were pretty horrible and it took huge advantage of those flaws.
Vigor is insane against RDW, or any deck with burn. They can snipe your duders and severely cripple the optimal elf synergy one can garner. Highly underrated card.
re: Vigor – Yes, it would be great vs burn decks that snipe your dudes away.. If you can resolve it (bearing in mind your ramp is probably being sniped away your looking @ roughly turn 11 to naturally draw 6 mana sources with a 34 land deck)in time.
Steely Resolve, Mark of Asylum, Sylvan Safekeeper, Dense Foliage,Seedcradle Witch etc do practically the same job just alot faster.Vigor does nothing that matters that any of these cards also do in a more relevant time scale. I can see it being moderately decent against GW aggro decks that lack removal, but even then I think i would rather have Eldrazi Monument, Mycoloth, Constant Mists, Ranger of Eos, Wellwisher, Glare of Subdual, Bathe in Light, Eladmri or Elvish Champion (all of which are incredibly hard for them to beat without a timely removal spell).
RE: Confidant/Mind Twist – i know they are in the list, i mentioned them because there the only two black cards that really excite me there.
As before, disclaimer that i haven’t played this deck in a few months and things might have shifted enough for any suggestions i make to be totally incorrect.
The meta has shifted away from Naya-style decks. I think you had your success then?
I thought Oath of Ghouls would be better than Oversold Cemetery because you start getting your guys back almost immediately.
Senseis Divining Top- remember that enemy triads can play nine (!) fetch lands.
Birchlore Rangers- the fact that he needed a pal meant I was losing out on a nice attacker or he was standing around, wishing he had a friend to cook me a rainbow mana pie.
If I were to rebuild Elves!, I would look into GW with a lot of basics. The power of Black made the deck act very clunky.
The format was basically
(in order of importance)
GW Aggro (sometimes splashing red)
5 colour greed
U based control (RBU, UW and mono blue)
some reanimator and other random stuff.
when i was playing alot. Not drastically different to today, but obviously their are some changes (like the RDW decks leaning more towards “repeatable” burn (creatures) now). The biggest difference is the comparitive paucity of forests in your average opponents list now, forestwalking was borderline broken at the time.
Remeber suggestions were only that, i put a ton of work into my later lists (first one was pretty bad) digging out random tech (bathe in light and elvish skysweeper are my favorites, but there were many others) to gain % points here and there.
The deck definately rewarded familiarity back then more so than any other deck i have ever played, theres alot of non obvious intereactions that should be considered when devising your gameplans on a turn by turn basis, this makes it a hard deck to just pick up and pilot and is also probably why most people complain that the decks massively inconsistant/weak etc.
If your just trying to throw out dudes fast as you can and beat face then your missing alot of the power that the elf synergies bring to the table.
I dislike the fragility of the current mana base, one of the things i originally aimed to be was nearly immune to blood moon and miners. I think its important enough that i wouldn’t even consider a deck that had massive vunerability to these effects.
If i was to build elves today i would aim heavily at the red decks, if you can’t find a way to have a hugely positive matchup there scrap it and find something that does. No point playing a deck that just top 8′s your likely to face red at least in the top8 so prepare for it (or play it with something to wreck the mirror match).
To say that Vigor would be realistically coming down turn 11, based on mana and the presumption that the burn player would be sniping mana-men (the least consequential in contrast to the Lords and more synergystic duders in the deck) seems a might bit pessimistic. I was more implying that it works nice with Natty Order, as well as the decks ability to just fart out tons of mana (which usually it just stops being able to abuse by virtue of emptying its hand).
Long story short, I don’t think Elves is a contender for a Tier One in 100CS, period. It’s like Goobos, but in reverse. Where Gobbos has explosive synergy, it simply doesn;t need it. Elves most definitely THRIVES upon this synergy. Topdecking burn and cannon fodder men is different than mana producers and the like. I have long said GW is just more solid, albeit less in the synergy department.
What makes decks great in this format is cards that have an overall deck synergy, but can also stand alone. while a deck can’t be made entirely of cards like this, you can come pretty darn close. Elves works the opposite on this philosophy, making it prone to horrifically random draws, blank top decks, and fragile combo disrupted byt the one thing all decks pack: creature removal.
So if you play Elves, win fast!!!
Quick aside: For Rec-Sur, esp with Oath of Ghouls, Faerie Macabre just seems unbelievably powerful and a total oversight on my sad behalf. I failed you again, Little Man!!!
Pretty much agree on your assessment of elves in the current meta, but then not playing gobbo’s or a deck that stomps the little red folk is probably a mistake also.
Maybe I’m just lucky, but normally RDW and Gobbos is a marginal hurdle at best for me. Admittedly, I have been burnt asunder on a few public occasions, but on the whole I think it simply comes down to knowing how to play the match (duh…).
You may use these HTML tags and attributes: <a href="" title=""> <abbr title=""> <acronym title=""> <b> <blockquote cite=""> <cite> <code> <del datetime=""> <em> <i> <q cite=""> <strike> <strong>
<a href="" title=""> <abbr title=""> <acronym title=""> <b> <blockquote cite=""> <cite> <code> <del datetime=""> <em> <i> <q cite=""> <strike> <strong>
See other content from ChrisKool